Don't you wish these D3 parents would quit complaining

[Unregistered]

That's actually undeniably false. If we're talking about kids who actually play, if there are any Tufts players who are better than starters/regulars for Harvard they would have gotten in Harvard. Tufts' median SATs are extremely close to that of Harvard. I know kids who didn't get in Tufts who would have gotten in Harvard if they could have played there.

Yeah. You know nothing about admissions. Everybody knows somebody who woulda/coulda/shoulda gotten in here or there. Garbage in, garbage out.

[Unregistered]

No, but Williams is better than Duke. If my kid chose Duke over Williams she'd be paying her own tuition.

Obviously many top D3 are better than many top D1. The top 20-30 schools in the country are evenly divided between D1 and D3. It doesn't take a genius to figure out why a player might opt for an MIT over Northwestern, Duke or even Stanford.

If a kid has the chance to go to Swarthmore or Boston College how does a parent let the kid choose BC? Financial limitation is the only valid excuse.

[Unregistered]

No, but Williams is better than Duke. If my kid chose Duke over Williams she'd be paying her own tuition.

I personally am not a fan of either school, but Williams is not better than Duke. When referring to the top 15-20 universities and LACs any kid's/family's choice (to the extent they have a choice) comes down to preferences, especially with respect to vibe. There are D1s I personally would prefer over Duke (a few Ivies, Stanford, UVA, Rice, Vandy, etc) and there are D3s I would prefer to Williams (Swat, Haverford, Carleton, Midd, Wesleyan, etc).

[Unregistered]

Yeah. You know nothing about admissions. Everybody knows somebody who woulda/coulda/shoulda gotten in here or there. Garbage in, garbage out.

Believe what you want, but I do know quite a bit about college admissions.

[Unregistered]

You are so tedious. I have addressed your concern about #3 twice in 20 minutes and over a 100 times in the past 2 years. Yes, NOT the majority of D3 players. We're talking about a small percentage, but I'm sure there are at least a few kids every, especially in Mass with our demographic and the whole prep school crowd, where there are offers from schools like Bucknell, Colgate, Lehigh, Holy Cross, Davidson, etc AND top academic D3s where the decision is a close call, and where some of those few may in fact choose a D3 (and very possibly in part because they believe they will play more and have a better athletic career at the D3). BTW, it's also a small percentage overall in terms of qualifying for top D3s academically and athletically. The majority of high school student-athletes do not qualify for those schools on one or both of those prongs.

You don't even have to go that low on the list of D1 schools before academic and athletic quality starts to slip. There's a huge gray area where things overlap, where the comparisons get tougher. Duke - duh. Obviously tops on both. Central Arkansas? For some Arkansas is a great fit on both fronts. For stronger students it won't be. For all I know it isn't tops for soccer either but it is D1. If the choice is play ok D1 soccer at an ok school vs ok soccer at a very good school, some will chose the latter. If D1 is the end goal for a player, even if it means compromising educational quality, then that's their choice. Some kids will make mistakes they have to correct later on. The vast majority will be just fine from get go and turn out to be happy, productive adults. It's just the first of many choices they will have to make as adults.

A few posters are trying to simplify it when in fact the decision process is quite complex. They don't want to admit that or that not all D1 is the same athletically or academically. Others won't admit the same about D3. Both sides feel the need to rip the decisions of young adults if it doesn't fit within their narrative. The adults are acting more childish than the kids making the choices.

[Unregistered]

Obviously many top D3 are better than many top D1. The top 20-30 schools in the country are evenly divided between D1 and D3. It doesn't take a genius to figure out why a player might opt for an MIT over Northwestern, Duke or even Stanford.

If a kid has the chance to go to Swarthmore or Boston College how does a parent let the kid choose BC? Financial limitation is the only valid excuse.

Oooooh, that's not going to be well received here.

[Unregistered]

Yes, there's a tendency on TS to make blanket statements about what's best for all. It would be better to accept that every individual's situation is different, in ways we don't know, and that is the reason for making different choices.

To the original suggestion about college players being average, the 20 boys that go d1 each year are about 0.5% of the male soccer players graduating from Mass. high schools each year. The 100 or so that join a d3 soccer team are about 2.5%. In that context, they are way better than "average".

On their college team, as in any sport, some play a lot, some not. No one has presented any data that Mass. players are less successful in college soccer than those from other states.

[Unregistered]

Oooooh, that's not going to be well received here.

I love Swat...probably one of my top 10 picks of all colleges in the USA. That said, if one of my kids projected to be a starter at BC in soccer, bball, or football, I would wholeheartedly embrace my kid's decision to choose BC. That's not a close call for a higher end athlete. The call is much tougher and perhaps swings the other way if we're talking Bucknell, Colgate, Holy Cross versus Swat.

-- Perspective

[Unregistered]

Yes, there's a tendency on TS to make blanket statements about what's best for all. It would be better to accept that every individual's situation is different, in ways we don't know, and that is the reason for making different choices.

To the original suggestion about college players being average, the 20 boys that go d1 each year are about 0.5% of the male soccer players graduating from Mass. high schools each year. The 100 or so that join a d3 soccer team are about 2.5%. In that context, they are way better than "average".

On their college team, as in any sport, some play a lot, some not. No one has presented any data that Mass. players are less successful in college soccer than those from other states.

Exactly. Even playing D3 is very, very difficult and far from "average" given the total pool of soccer players. The fact that D1 is even more exclusive doesn't change that fact. Cannot understand how anyone's agenda is served by minimizing either.

-- Perspective

[Unregistered]

Oooooh, that's not going to be well received here.

So true. Wonder how many current BC students had that choice. Sure, Swart is more selective. But if your interest was nursing, might you choose BC? If you had family in the Boston area, might you choose BC? If you liked seeing and cheering at the semi-pro hockey, basketball and football games, might you choose BC? If you wanted to be close enough to ski areas to do that on weekends, might you choose BC?

[Unregistered]

You are so tedious. I have addressed your concern about #3 twice in 20 minutes and over a 100 times in the past 2 years. Yes, NOT the majority of D3 players. We're talking about a small percentage, but I'm sure there are at least a few kids every, especially in Mass with our demographic and the whole prep school crowd, where there are offers from schools like Bucknell, Colgate, Lehigh, Holy Cross, Davidson, etc AND top academic D3s where the decision is a close call, and where some of those few may in fact choose a D3 (and very possibly in part because they believe they will play more and have a better athletic career at the D3). BTW, it's also a small percentage overall in terms of qualifying for top D3s academically and athletically. The majority of high school student-athletes do not qualify for those schools on one or both of those prongs.

You're being tedious. You're talking about a very small percentage of players. Your argument makes so sense and only applies to what? Maybe a couple players?

I'm referring to the bigger picture. Not one kid out of 500 players who happened to be that exact scenario you prescribed.

[Unregistered]

You don't even have to go that low on the list of D1 schools before academic and athletic quality starts to slip. There's a huge gray area where things overlap, where the comparisons get tougher. Duke - duh. Obviously tops on both. Central Arkansas? For some Arkansas is a great fit on both fronts. For stronger students it won't be. For all I know it isn't tops for soccer either but it is D1. If the choice is play ok D1 soccer at an ok school vs ok soccer at a very good school, some will chose the latter. If D1 is the end goal for a player, even if it means compromising educational quality, then that's their choice. Some kids will make mistakes they have to correct later on. The vast majority will be just fine from get go and turn out to be happy, productive adults. It's just the first of many choices they will have to make as adults.

A few posters are trying to simplify it when in fact the decision process is quite complex. They don't want to admit that or that not all D1 is the same athletically or academically. Others won't admit the same about D3. Both sides feel the need to rip the decisions of young adults if it doesn't fit within their narrative. The adults are acting more childish than the kids making the choices.

The same applies to D3 schools but academic reputation of a school slips that much faster as you look down the D3 list.

[Unregistered]

You're being tedious. You're talking about a very small percentage of players. Your argument makes so sense and only applies to what? Maybe a couple players?

I'm referring to the bigger picture. Not one kid out of 500 players who happened to be that exact scenario you prescribed.

Really? And how many players in Mass are we talking about a year that justifies a case for turning the whole system of play upside down? Many of the arguments presented in this forum boil down to a tiny number of kids. Put it this way. There are far more kids in New England that face the kind of choices I described than those who have a shot at national teams.

[Unregistered]

The argument is simpler than it has to be.

Is the top D3 school academically and athletically better than the top D1 school?
The answer is no.

Is the top D1 school such as Harvard, Stanford or Duke academically and athletically better than the top D3 schools? The answer is yes.

This systematically trickles down to the entire D1/D3 spectrum.
There are tons of D3 schools no one has even heard of and the education is sub-par.

[Unregistered]

The argument is simpler than it has to be.

Is the top D3 school academically and athletically better than the top D1 school?
The answer is no.

Is the top D1 school such as Harvard, Stanford or Duke academically and athletically better than the top D3 schools? The answer is yes.

This systematically trickles down to the entire D1/D3 spectrum.
There are tons of D3 schools no one has even heard of and the education is sub-par.

Incorrect.

The top D1s are better than the top D3s athletically. They are not demonstrably better academically.