Town/Club Tug -o-War

[Unregistered]

Town Soccer programs are completely ineffective for true soccer development. I cannot believe the disparity of training. Our town soccer program emphasizing booting the ball, get it out to the wing and never go inside. My daughter is confused. Her town coach always says never go inside with the ball and the club tells her to go inside often. So every parent on the sideline watching the town games are yelling and applauding the "send it" mentality (and they will defend this)! Can we just finally call it Town Fun leagues and have them officially let the clubs take over the development minded youth soccer player?

[Unregistered]

And the sad thing is they get training which reinforces this mentality. In defense of town, they are volunteers who run the show vs Club who are dedicated and paid to perform. Town soccer is simply awful by and large.

[Unregistered]

Town Soccer programs are completely ineffective for true soccer development. I cannot believe the disparity of training. Our town soccer program emphasizing booting the ball, get it out to the wing and never go inside. My daughter is confused. Her town coach always says never go inside with the ball and the club tells her to go inside often. So every parent on the sideline watching the town games are yelling and applauding the "send it" mentality (and they will defend this)! Can we just finally call it Town Fun leagues and have them officially let the clubs take over the development minded youth soccer player?

This is often a view into the upcoming high school years

[Unregistered]

Or maybe 90% of the parents that have kids playing "club" should take a more realistic view of their child's soccer potential and realize that playing "fun" town soccer with their friends and neighbors is all they need... or that their kid wants!!

[Unregistered]

Town Soccer programs are completely ineffective for true soccer development. I cannot believe the disparity of training. Our town soccer program emphasizing booting the ball, get it out to the wing and never go inside. My daughter is confused. Her town coach always says never go inside with the ball and the club tells her to go inside often. So every parent on the sideline watching the town games are yelling and applauding the "send it" mentality (and they will defend this)! Can we just finally call it Town Fun leagues and have them officially let the clubs take over the development minded youth soccer player?

Generalize much? A much more accurate picture is that the quality of town soccer depends upon the town. Bedford NH top town teams beat good club teams from MA all the time. Andover, Danvers, Newburyport, Winchester etc all have excellent top tier town teams up through U14. The quality of town soccer runs the full range of the spectrum. Just as club soccer does.

Don't worry about your daughter being confused. She'll figure it out. Even the top U14 players are frequently confused on the field. Soccer is a complex game that takes a lifetime to master. Only a handful of players master every aspect of the game. Be patient. Your kid is not going to be a professional soccer player. Get her into a situation where she is happy. If she is happy in her current situation butt out. It is her athletic and social experience designed to help her develop into a confident competent adult. It is not YOUR experience.

[Unregistered]

Or maybe 90% of the parents that have kids playing "club" should take a more realistic view of their child's soccer potential and realize that playing "fun" town soccer with their friends and neighbors is all they need... or that their kid wants!!

I don't completely disagree with you. But, at a certain age the kid joins to learn how to play. If they are learning the wrong way what is the point? And, the "club" players and parents we know and socialize with really do not have an unrealistic view of their kids talents either. I think this is an easy blanket excuse to say that the parents are really something they are not. Some parents do, however, clearly have this problem.

There is just a complete philisophical and qualitative difference in the training. No problem playing to just have fun but don't call it development.

[Unregistered]

Generalize much? A much more accurate picture is that the quality of town soccer depends upon the town. Bedford NH top town teams beat good club teams from MA all the time. Andover, Danvers, Newburyport, Winchester etc all have excellent top tier town teams up through U14. The quality of town soccer runs the full range of the spectrum. Just as club soccer does.

Don't worry about your daughter being confused. She'll figure it out. Even the top U14 players are frequently confused on the field. Soccer is a complex game that takes a lifetime to master. Only a handful of players master every aspect of the game. Be patient. Your kid is not going to be a professional soccer player. Get her into a situation where she is happy. If she is happy in her current situation butt out. It is her athletic and social experience designed to help her develop into a confident competent adult. It is not YOUR experience.

I think there are exceptions to every rule. There is the occasional town program that is pretty good and they (like the example above) will compete against some club teams (although probably not the more competitive programs). I think the person who started the thread has a point. There is a different philosophy by and large. We see it. My kid loves town soccer. At least in our town it is a "fun league". Nothing wrong with that.

[Unregistered]

In the last five years, the number of club teams in Massachusetts has almost doubled. Go back on the MAPLE page and look at the 2005 spring schedules/results. The teams on that sheet represent every kid that was playing club. There was no MASC, no NEP, no MPS SOE League, no ECNL and the very few teams that did play R1PL usually also played MAPLE. At U15 there were 24 teams with maybe 380 girls total training with a club program. Most 12, 13 and 14s that played club also played for their town teams.

Whether the explosion of "opportunities" to train and play club has benefited the Massachusetts soccer community is an open question. I think most would admit that we "produce" better (and more) players at the very elite level than ever before. However, I'm not sure that the overall quality of the girls high school game is much improved. The middle of the club spectrum probably hasn't changed much. What has evolved is a beefed up top (via the ECNL and National Leagues) and an expanded botton (remember that MASC was originally started because MAPLE had strict limits on teams). That expanded bottom has come at the expense of the town programs - especially at U15+ when dual rostering ends.

Seven or eight years ago there were town teams that were competitive with club programs. That is rarely the case today, especially once dual rostering is over. To combat the loss of players, the town programs are trying to become more club like. Hiring professional DOCs and partnering with big clubs (like MPS) to augment local training. But at some point people should begin to question... why? If very very few players will play soccer beyond high school, is there an actual NEED to have 600-700 kids from each year active in club programs. Certainly that is great for the clubs' business models, but for most of those families is it just a fool's errand?

There have been attempts by leaders in the Mass Youth Soccer Association to try to sound a warning that the lowest levels of club soccer are a waste of limited resources and that those kids could (should) be better served in their local town programs. There have even been minor efforts to regulate that belief. But we are a free market economy, and let's face it, if there are customers, someone will oblige them with the product they desire.

[Unregistered]

In the last five years, the number of club teams in Massachusetts has almost doubled. Go back on the MAPLE page and look at the 2005 spring schedules/results. The teams on that sheet represent every kid that was playing club. There was no MASC, no NEP, no MPS SOE League, no ECNL and the very few teams that did play R1PL usually also played MAPLE. At U15 there were 24 teams with maybe 380 girls total training with a club program. Most 12, 13 and 14s that played club also played for their town teams.

Whether the explosion of "opportunities" to train and play club has benefited the Massachusetts soccer community is an open question. I think most would admit that we "produce" better (and more) players at the very elite level than ever before. However, I'm not sure that the overall quality of the girls high school game is much improved. The middle of the club spectrum probably hasn't changed much. What has evolved is a beefed up top (via the ECNL and National Leagues) and an expanded botton (remember that MASC was originally started because MAPLE had strict limits on teams). That expanded bottom has come at the expense of the town programs - especially at U15+ when dual rostering ends.

Seven or eight years ago there were town teams that were competitive with club programs. That is rarely the case today, especially once dual rostering is over. To combat the loss of players, the town programs are trying to become more club like. Hiring professional DOCs and partnering with big clubs (like MPS) to augment local training. But at some point people should begin to question... why? If very very few players will play soccer beyond high school, is there an actual NEED to have 600-700 kids from each year active in club programs. Certainly that is great for the clubs' business models, but for most of those families is it just a fool's errand?

There have been attempts by leaders in the Mass Youth Soccer Association to try to sound a warning that the lowest levels of club soccer are a waste of limited resources and that those kids could (should) be better served in their local town programs. There have even been minor efforts to regulate that belief. But we are a free market economy, and let's face it, if there are customers, someone will oblige them with the product they desire.

Absolutely yes someone will oblige them. It seems like in our town (some exceptions however) coaches go through the motions with the kids. The kids who start on the travel teams are mostly (90%) club players. Another point you made resonated with me. We were in one of the borttom tear clubs and I can't tell you how much money was wasted there. Very nice people but.....

Anyway, great post.

[Unregistered]

Ask yourself this hypothetical question: Could the state's top HS team (with a roster full of club players) beat a team comprised of U Conn college basketball and lacrosse players, none of who played club soccer? What if the college team had 3 weeks to train together with a top coach? Then allow the college team to be augmented with just three players from the Huskie's soccer team (forward, CM and keeper). My guess is that with just 3 top players (and 8 incredible athletes) the older stronger girls mop up the floor with the HS team. The older girls may not play the "club" style we all love, but their speed and agressiveness (and just enough tactics) will be very hard for the HS team to handle. Even though you would expect that they are the "better" technical soccer team.

[Unregistered]

The prior poster who clarified that Town soccer is comprised of volunteers that offer their time as compared to club soccer which is comprised of 'trained' coaches. The 'training' part of the coaching is where towns can step in and take some control. Needham is such a town that has embraced the coaching selection process and the providing of courses to help educate the parent-coaches.
There are many clubs that do a great job getting coaches, but then a host that do not. Having a license does not mean you are a good coach. It may only mean that you attended the course and paid your fee.

On the whole, the coaching is better in the club system and does, hopefully (but not always) avoid having 'dad' or 'mom' coach their own child's team. With that said, you cannot discount the difference in cost. This alone is where parents have to really consider what their end-goals are and how realistic they are being.

The recent wrench thrown into the system is the rising cost to play town soccer. While it once cost 150-200 for the Fall and Spring combined, it now cost 400-500...still less than club, but enough so that you want to be assured that the coach will be worth it.

[Unregistered]

In my view, both town and club are great! There are many types of soccer players and having more options is better than having less.

The fact that your child may have outgrown town soccer or the coaches in your particular town aren't currently the best doesn't mean that town soccer isn't worthwhile for other children.

[Unregistered]

Town Soccer programs are completely ineffective for true soccer development. I cannot believe the disparity of training. Our town soccer program emphasizing booting the ball, get it out to the wing and never go inside. My daughter is confused. Her town coach always says never go inside with the ball and the club tells her to go inside often. So every parent on the sideline watching the town games are yelling and applauding the "send it" mentality (and they will defend this)! Can we just finally call it Town Fun leagues and have them officially let the clubs take over the development minded youth soccer player?

This is actually funny for me to hear because my daughter did Winter training with an "elite" team last year and they kept pushing the idea that you always want to go outside to the wing... Your town soccer coach is preaching what the "elite" team coach was saying to my daughter. Just keeping it real. (I remember it because it had me scratching my head at times).

Also, our family made the decision to stay with her very good town team (with a paid coach... who we have been happy with), due to other siblings activities, long commute to "elite" team practices, etc... My daughter's team played against and beat the "elite" team that she would have gone to a few weeks back. I have to say... I was not impressed with the "elite" team... It actually made me very happy that we made the decision that we did in the end. Having said that, my daughter is U12, so there will likely come a time when we make a move, but for now... Her town team seems to be getting good if not better training / development than the more (supposedly) "elite" team. And, there's the added bonus that I don't have to spend almost 2 hours in my car driving her to practices twice a week... after her middle school soccer practices / games. This is a very individual thing... and very much depends on the specific town / club / coach scenario that you happen to have.

[Unregistered]

Ask yourself this hypothetical question: Could the state's top HS team (with a roster full of club players) beat a team comprised of U Conn college basketball and lacrosse players, none of who played club soccer? What if the college team had 3 weeks to train together with a top coach? Then allow the college team to be augmented with just three players from the Huskie's soccer team (forward, CM and keeper). My guess is that with just 3 top players (and 8 incredible athletes) the older stronger girls mop up the floor with the HS team. The older girls may not play the "club" style we all love, but their speed and agressiveness (and just enough tactics) will be very hard for the HS team to handle. Even though you would expect that they are the "better" technical soccer team.

I see your point BUT (always a but in there) here is the counter argument. I have a friend who played professionally in England and is currently a coach at a "brand name" club in Massachusetts. His position is this:

1. Americans, in general, value true athleticism over skill.
2. We rely too much on the superior athleticism argument over skill which is what you outlined above.
3. If a player (soccer player) has good athleticism and superior training and skills, in a game like soccer, the skilled players will win almost every time.

His argument is that this is why this the American value system basically means that the US will never dominate international mens soccer.

Now, I am unsure who is correct in this argument but in my little world seeing a top girls team (which I am most familiar with) beat another team does support the skills argument. My opinion is that the players on a top club team athletically are not superior to the 4th or fifth rated team. It comes down to skill and team play.

So, unsure who come out ahead.

[Unregistered]

This is actually funny for me to hear because my daughter did Winter training with an "elite" team last year and they kept pushing the idea that you always want to go outside to the wing... Your town soccer coach is preaching what the "elite" team coach was saying to my daughter. Just keeping it real. (I remember it because it had me scratching my head at times).

Also, our family made the decision to stay with her very good town team (with a paid coach... who we have been happy with), due to other siblings activities, long commute to "elite" team practices, etc... My daughter's team played against and beat the "elite" team that she would have gone to a few weeks back. I have to say... I was not impressed with the "elite" team... It actually made me very happy that we made the decision that we did in the end. Having said that, my daughter is U12, so there will likely come a time when we make a move, but for now... Her town team seems to be getting good if not better training / development than the more (supposedly) "elite" team. And, there's the added bonus that I don't have to spend almost 2 hours in my car driving her to practices twice a week... after her middle school soccer practices / games. This is a very individual thing... and very much depends on the specific town / club / coach scenario that you happen to have.

IMHO, it depends on the situation. Sometimes it makes sense to play wide and sometimes not ...

The younger the kids, the more they have a "direct" approach to the game. I'm guessing that these play it wide instructions might be to trains the kids to think differently on occasion.